Jul 29 2008 Leaving kids in the car

Subject: "Need to vent!" Previous topic | Next topic


lalberta
Tue Jul-29-08 06:22 PM
Member since Nov 05th 2007
75 posts


#364893, "Need to vent!"

Pleast tell me I'm not the only one who does this . . . .


Okay, so I just took the kids to go get ice cream, I'm by myself as usual, and I was debating on whether to lug the choo choo wagon, or just wing it once i got there.

So, I get there and there is no one in line, and the front parking spot is open. So, I jump out and leave the kids in the car, windows down, but doors locked and movie on, so they're entertained. My trio is two and my oldest is five.

Like i said, there is no one in line, so i'm literally two/three minutes. on my way back, there's a woman & her son sitting on a bench near my car. She says, "Maam, i notice you have small children in the car, you know i think it's against the law to leave them like that!" i said, "well, i have two year old triplets and a five year old and they out number me, so sometimes i do what i have to do."

she says, "i have little ones too, i know it's hard, but it's just not safe."

you know - it's not like i was going food shopping and left them in the car, with the windows rolled up for two hours in the blistering sun. It was 7:00 in the evening on a nice day, i was right there. give me a freaking break!! i wanted to just tell her that having "little ones at home" and dealing with two year old triplets on a daily basis don't even compare - so keep your two cents to yourself!!

but now i'm panicking that she took down my licese plate number & is going to report me!?!?!?!

ugh!!! i hate the public!!
Lisa

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Replies to this topic


RE: Need to vent!, garberr, Jul 29th 2008, #1
RE: Need to vent!, morethemerrier, Jul 30th 2008, #24
RE: Need to vent!, Mamakitten3, Jul 29th 2008, #2
RE: Need to vent!, stefanir, Jul 29th 2008, #3
RE: Need to vent!, morethemerrier, Jul 30th 2008, #25
RE: Need to vent!, Sheller223, Jul 29th 2008, #4
RE: Need to vent!, Triplethefun04, Jul 29th 2008, #5
RE: Need to vent!, pixilee, Jul 29th 2008, #6
RE: Need to vent!, foreveramom, Jul 29th 2008, #7
RE: Need to vent!, GRACY1, Jul 29th 2008, #9
RE: Need to vent!, 6_olive_shoots, Jul 29th 2008, #11
RE: Need to vent!, foreveramom, Jul 29th 2008, #12
RE: Need to vent!, MSTAR, Jul 29th 2008, #16
RE: Need to vent!, morethemerrier, Jul 30th 2008, #27
RE: Need to vent!, LolasLadies, Jul 30th 2008, #30
RE: Need to vent!, morethemerrier, Jul 30th 2008, #31
RE: Need to vent!, lsmiller, Jul 30th 2008, #38
RE: Need to vent!, sandsstone, Jul 29th 2008, #8
RE: Need to vent!, foreveramom, Jul 29th 2008, #14
RE: Need to vent!, PA triplets, Jul 29th 2008, #15
RE: Need to vent!, gracy3, Jul 30th 2008, #36
RE: Need to vent!, Mom23in2003, Jul 29th 2008, #10
RE: Need to vent!, HOWMANY, Jul 29th 2008, #13
RE: Need to vent!, GRACY1, Jul 29th 2008, #17
RE: Need to vent!, MSTAR, Jul 29th 2008, #20
RE: Need to vent!, tvmurphy, Jul 29th 2008, #18
RE: Need to vent!, GRACY1, Jul 29th 2008, #21
RE: Need to vent!, fof, Jul 30th 2008, #28
RE: Need to vent!, foreveramom, Jul 30th 2008, #33
RE: Need to vent!, albentrip, Jul 29th 2008, #19
RE: Need to vent!, Katrina_Jason, Jul 29th 2008, #22
RE: Need to vent!, lovemy5boys, Jul 29th 2008, #23
RE: Need to vent!, MargieInAZ, Jul 30th 2008, #26
RE: Need to vent!, Tasha, Jul 30th 2008, #51
Wow. Most of you must live in the 14 states, morethemerrier, Jul 30th 2008, #29
RE: Wow. Most of you must live in the 14 states, MSTAR, Jul 30th 2008, #32
RE: Wow. Most of you must live in the 14 states, sandsstone, Jul 30th 2008, #41
RE: Wow. Most of you must live in the 14 states, foreveramom, Jul 30th 2008, #45
RE: Need to vent!, foreveramom, Jul 30th 2008, #34
RE: Need to vent!, TiffaniRay, Jul 30th 2008, #35
RE: Need to vent!, LolasLadies, Jul 30th 2008, #44
RE: Need to vent!, casanndra, Jul 30th 2008, #37
RE: Need to vent!, joan1256, Jul 30th 2008, #39
RE: Need to vent!, MelissaChicago, Jul 30th 2008, #40
RE: Need to vent!, fof, Jul 30th 2008, #42
RE: Need to vent!, 6BlueEyes, Jul 30th 2008, #47
RE: Need to vent!, lsmiller, Jul 30th 2008, #43
RE: Need to vent!, VonWasden, Jul 30th 2008, #46
RE: Need to vent!, fulloffaith, Jul 30th 2008, #48
RE: Need to vent!, StefMac2, Jul 30th 2008, #49
RE: Need to vent!, gracy3, Jul 30th 2008, #50



garberr
Tue Jul-29-08 06:28 PM
Member since Nov 05th 2007
165 posts


#364897, "RE: Need to vent!"
In response to Reply # 0

Well, not to be rude but it is against the law and very dangerous. What seems so innocent can quickly turn into a tradegy.

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morethemerrier
Wed Jul-30-08 01:11 AM
Member since Nov 05th 2007
2081 posts


#364979, "RE: Need to vent!"
In response to Reply # 1

Depends on where you live.

In Maryland the law says.. (I have paraphrased a bit, but this is almost exact)

No one under the age of 8 may be left in a building, enclosure or vehicle, UNLESS THE building, enclosure or VEHICLE is IN THE LINE OF SIGHT OF THE PERSON charged with their care, and the party in charge must be 13 or older.

Car at gas pump, pay outside window... okay. Pay inside store... if you can see your vehicle at all times.. okay. If your line of sight is blocked,. not okay.

Car in front of ice cream store, ice cream store has outside window.. okay. Ice cream store has no outside ordering window, but has giant front windows in which the car is always visible to the inside of the store.. okay. if you have to face the back of the store for any reason.. not okay.

And as long as you can physically SEE the building, enclosure or vehicle, even it if is 1/4 of a mile away... it is still not a violation of Maryland Law. And you cannot possibly be in violation of the law if you are IN the building, enclosure or vehicle with them.

It is, however, illegal in Maryland to leave a car's engine running unless there is a licensed driver in the vehicle.

As to danger...

Did you know that statistically speaking a child is more at risk for death or injury while walking in a parking lot or "driveway" type area, than they are if they are left in a vehicle?

The problem is, the media never headlines the child that, as a pedestrian, is hit and killed, but front pages and leading storys the one that is left in the car that is car jacked. Children in this country are hit and killed every single day, walking in mall parking lots, ran over in their own driveways, going to school, leaving playgrounds,and yet, only two or three times a year does it become huge news that a child dies from being left locked up in an CLOSED UP un-attended vehicle.

She ensured the safety of her children. The windows were down. The car was locked. I'm taking a stab at the fact that if the car was locked, then she had the keys and the car wasn't running. If it was, shame shame shame. Also if she could not see the car from inside the store, she would be violating our law and creating a potentially dangerous situation.

But then again, I'm going by Maryland law, maybe it is unlawful in her state.

EVERY SINGLE TIME I took them anywhere by myself, until they were old enough to walk out of the house as a group and get into my vehicle as a group, I was forced to violate Maryland law because it was not POSSIBLE to put all three of them in the vehicle at the same time once they were out of infant carriers. I could carry all three infant carriers at the same time.. Therefore, once I got one strapped into a car seat and went back for another... the car was no longer in my line of sight.. I guess I was supposed to tear down the back wall of my kitchen and open it directly to the driveway?
MTM - mom to Michael(84),Stephan(85), Thomas, Matthew and Kathryn - born 12/27/99 at 32w 0 days

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Mamakitten3
Tue Jul-29-08 07:09 PM
Member since Nov 05th 2007
965 posts


#364906, "RE: Need to vent!"
In response to Reply # 0

I know its a total PITA but she could very well report you to CPS and they will open an investigation. My ST was telling me that one of her clients got out of the car and went to the ATM(6ftaway) and she was under investigation for a year and had to take parenting classes. I think we all have been tempted to do this at one time another but its just not worth the risk.

When I was 16yrs old and incredibly stupid, my BFF and I were babysitting her younger siblings 7,5 and 4yrs old. We left them in the parking lot at our work for 5min to p/u our paychecks. The 7yr old got scared because the 4yr old was freaking out and he rolled up all the windows in just under 100 degree heat. When we got to the car they were all sweaty and scared, it was horrible experience for them but it taught us a great big lesson. Its never worth the time and energy you might save to cut corners when it comes to your kiddos.

www.groups.yahoo.com/group/HOMlosangeles

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stefanir
Tue Jul-29-08 07:11 PM
Member since Nov 05th 2007
42 posts


#364908, "RE: Need to vent!"
In response to Reply # 0

It is annoying, especially when you know you are literally just a few feet away from them, and the car is within sight the entire time.

However, it's completely and totally against the law. When I get annoyed I remember that I don't want to be "that" Mom who ends up on the evening news b/c I left my kids in the car to go shopping. Even if it did seem safe, you don't know what could happen...and if that's not enough...think of the embarassment a public scandal would bring. There are some real sticklers out there.

That being said, I didn't know the law when I first had my kiddos and left them once to run into 7-11 to get a slurpee. Same situation, car locked, car on, etc. When I got home my husband informed me of the error of my ways. Oh the days I long for an ice cold slurpee...but can't get one b/c I have three babies in the car. Oh well, empty calories I didn't need anyway.

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morethemerrier
Wed Jul-30-08 01:13 AM
Member since Nov 05th 2007
2081 posts


#364980, "RE: Need to vent!"
In response to Reply # 3

>It is annoying, especially when you know you are literally
>just a few feet away from them, and the car is within sight
>the entire time.

Not in my state would "literally just a few feet away from the, and the car is within sight the entire time" situation be against the law.
>\
MTM - mom to Michael(84),Stephan(85), Thomas, Matthew and Kathryn - born 12/27/99 at 32w 0 days

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Sheller223
Tue Jul-29-08 07:16 PM
Member since Jul 18th 2005
776 posts


#364910, "RE: Need to vent!"
In response to Reply # 0

I DO NOT leave my kids in the car by themselves. Period. There is one time that I did when they were around 2 months old and I still carry that guilt around to this day! It was my first time out with them to take them to the pedi and I had to get gas. Well, my sleep-deprived brain thought the gas pump said that I had to pay inside. I panicked, not knowing what to do. I went inside with my eyes glued to the van the entire time and completely went bananas with the 'what-ifs'. I still can't believe I did that. It makes my stomach hurt.

Not only is it probably against the law in some states, but incredibly dangerous! I probably would have said something too if I had been in that woman's place. It sounds like she was just looking out for the welfare of the kids.


Michelle
ggg born March 15, 2005
35.2 wks

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Triplethefun04
Tue Jul-29-08 07:17 PM
Member since Jul 18th 2005
698 posts


#364911, "RE: Need to vent!"
In response to Reply # 0
Tue Jul-29-08 07:24 PM by Triplethefun04

Haven't read the other responses.

I've taken my kids out alone since infancy, so I know how it is.

But I would NEVER leave my children in a car, unless it's an absolute emergency!! Running in for ice cream is not an emergency. If no one was in line, you parked right in front of the place, why not just get them out and give them that thrill to get their ice cream?

I honestly don't blame the woman for saying something to you and pulling the triplet card doesn't make it okay! I have hovered by a car where someone has left children of questionable age behind in the car. It's not right. Children can get hurt, taken or DIE in cars!! IN MINUTES!!

Kudos for you for leaving the windows down, way to go... But not really. Don't go somewhere you can't take them with you or go through the drive thru if you don't crave dragging them in with you.

I have personally followed a story of a father who lost his precious son in a car.

Please think twice before doing this again! If she doesn't turn in your plate number, consider yourself lucky. The next time you might not be, whether it be CPS or God forbid - worse...

Just my 2 cents on this topic and one that I won't budge on, no matter how many justifications a parent makes!

ETA for punctuation...

Michelle
(formerly known as bsebllmom9 )

http://triplethefunplus2.blogspot.com/

Tyler 17 1/2 years!!
Steph 15 1/2 years!!
Ayden, Ryley & Dylan 3 1/2 years!!

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pixilee
Tue Jul-29-08 07:37 PM
Member since Nov 05th 2007
1668 posts


#364913, "RE: Need to vent!"
In response to Reply # 0
Tue Jul-29-08 07:48 PM by pixilee

A few years back I was in a drycleaning shop when a woman parked right outside the doors, leaving her child in the car to pick up her drycleaning. Unfortunately for her, a police officer pulled up just behind her.

If your windows were down, with keys in the ignition to run their movie, someone could have jumped into your car in the blink of an eye and drove off with your children.

It is not safe to leave your children in the car. This woman you are speaking so harshly about was right.

This is what I found in the California Vehicle Code (where I live).

UNATTENDED CHILDREN IN MOTOR VEHICLES
It is illegal to leave a child six years of age or younger unattended in a motor vehicle when:

There are conditions that present a significant risk to the child’s health or safety. Example: Leaving a child in a closed car on a very hot day.

The vehicle’s engine is running, the keys are in the ignition, or both. Children can start or move the car causing injuries and/or deaths to themselves or others.

Exception: The child may be left under the supervision of a person 12 years of age or older.

The court may fine violators and require the person to attend a community education program.

Also, the penalties for leaving an unattended child in a vehicle are more severe if the child is injured, requires emergency medical services, or dies.
Jonna

B 14
B 10
G (Stillborn Angel 4/16/05)
BGB 1/06 @ 27 wks

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foreveramom
Tue Jul-29-08 07:49 PM
Member since Jan 30th 2006
1073 posts


#364915, "RE: Need to vent!"
In response to Reply # 0

I am one to report mothers who leave their kids in the car. A two year old can learn to unbuckle a carseat belt and tumble out the window in just a few quick seconds. My ds learned how to undo his buckle when he was two. I learned this while I sat in the driver's seat in our driveway. I thought maybe I had not snapped it properly. I looked back after buckling him in again and sure enough, he'd already begun to pinch and unclasp the chest belt and unsnapped the crotch straps.

You had to turn your back for even 10 seconds to make your selection, to pay, to whatever. That's enough time for something bad to happen.

What if you had slipped on the floor while in there and broken your ankle while your four kids were in the car alone. There are so many other "what ifs."

I don't go anywhere where I'm not prepared to take all four inside with me, no matter how briefly. Even in to drop a $20.00 at a gas station. I just don't do it. Ever. And I personally get angry when I see someone doing that. Having triplets is no excuse to put them at risk, imho.

As an alternative, I have called a few places ahead of time and told them I was on my own with a car full of children and asked if they wouldn't mind running my order out to me - pizza, Chinese carry-out, whatever. They are always happy to oblige.

I've also asked the people in the drivethru at CVS if they wouldn't mind throwing some Children's Motrin or whatever into the slot along with my Rx's while I'm there if I know I can't run in for a few extra little things. I'd never ask when they're busy. I've never been turned down or gotten anything but a helpful attitude.

Also, I've caught employees as they're taking a smoke break out in front of convenience stores and asked them if they wouldn't mind if they have no customers, if they'd grab me a gallon of milk (showing them my car full of kids). I've only ever gotten happy-faced employees thrilled to help out the mom with a buttload of little kids.

And when it doesn't work out, I just don't do it.
Mom of: Kristi(22), Kevin(19), Kelli(17), Angus(5) and GGB - Ruca, Nadia and Max (3) Born 10-14-04 at 34 weeks.
www.angusandthetriplets.com
also www.angusandthetriplets.blogspot.com

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GRACY1
Tue Jul-29-08 08:57 PM
Member since Nov 05th 2007
73 posts


#364934, "RE: Need to vent!"
In response to Reply # 7

I have read all the replies on here and am sitting here thinking to myself I am glad i did not post this, seriously. I thought this was supposed to be a SUPPORTIVE group.Some of the responses are just rude. Yes, while it is not a good idea to leave children in a car unattended, why do some of you feel the need to judge. I know that with all the people on this site there is a percentage of us that have left our children in a car unattended at least once and regretted it but they are probably too scared to post now because of the attacking nature you who have posted have chosen to take. Don't you think it would have been more helpful to give advice not be critical of the poster. I realize this is not the response most of you think you should get but hopefully maybe one of you who replied will step off your high horse and realize that not everything is picture perfect,some of us make mistakes,it would be nice to know there was a place to go even if you screw up that someone would say"While i understand your frustration with that woman,it is never safe to leave your children unattended"How hard was that. Again, i am probably going to get some backlash from this reply but who cares.Think how much more help you could be to someone if you give them helpful advice instead of rude comments. As for the people who sit by the car and wait for the person to come out,why not ask if they need assistance. as for the people who call cps, how do you know what is going on in that persons life, who are you to judge what is appropriate for a family.Don't judge lest ye be judged. GRACY1

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6_olive_shoots
Tue Jul-29-08 09:16 PM
Member since Jul 18th 2005
475 posts


#364942, "RE: Need to vent!"
In response to Reply # 9
Tue Jul-29-08 09:21 PM by 6_olive_shoots

Wow, seriously???

She was getting ice cream, it was not an emergency!

She was the one to post it here looking for comments! What on earth is "judgmental" about commenting on a post when ASKED to?!

I applaud the other woman for having the courage to speak up. Far too many people these days "don't want to get involved". It only takes a minute or two for disaster to strike in the heat! Not to mention leaving the keys in, doors locked or not, windows down or not, it only takes a minute...The news is FULL of people with injured or kidnapped or dead kids who left them "for just a minute". Thank God the OP's kids were OK. All you need is some sort of delay inside the store - clerk on the phone or something, it could have turned out a lot differently.

As a footnote, I didn't think any of the posts were rude. Difference of opinion, I guess. I may have missed some. "Support" doesn't necessarily mean agreement, BTW. Sometimes support is not what we want to hear.
Kari S.

Mom to BBB 17, 14, 10
BBG 9/25/01

My story of nursing triplets http://triplestuff.blogspot.com/2008/01/yes-i-nursed-my-triplets.html

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foreveramom
Tue Jul-29-08 09:17 PM
Member since Jan 30th 2006
1073 posts


#364943, "RE: Need to vent!"
In response to Reply # 9

>as for the people who call cps, how
>do you know what is going on in that persons life, who are you
>to judge what is appropriate for a family.Don't judge lest ye
be judged. GRACY1

I contact the Sheriff's Dept if I see small children in a running car in a parking lot and I don't care what the circumstance is, there is no reason for that. I actually saw two small children huddled in a dark car in a hospital parking lot in the middle of the night. The family was inside in the emergency room. I ran back inside the hospital and reported it. No excuse. None. Those kids were both under four and I could have kidnapped them myself and nobody would have known.

I'll not apologize for my comments. If it's harsh, then so be it. The original poster wasn't coming on to say she felt horrible about what she had done. She came on to say she was worried she'd be reported and hates "the public."

BTW, I did offer some suggestions of ways to get around the whole "by yourself with kids" thing.
Mom of: Kristi(22), Kevin(19), Kelli(17), Angus(5) and GGB - Ruca, Nadia and Max (3) Born 10-14-04 at 34 weeks.
www.angusandthetriplets.com
also www.angusandthetriplets.blogspot.com

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MSTAR
Tue Jul-29-08 09:23 PM
Member since Jul 18th 2005
1789 posts


#364947, "RE: Need to vent!"
In response to Reply # 9

Gracy,

What the original poster did is a FELONY in the state of Nevada. That's right. You lose your children and go to jail. You CANNOT leave your children in the car FOR ANY REASON in my state. Not even for 30 seconds. We actually had a huge campaign here all last year and several parents were made huge examples of, including some poor chap who just ran in for his Starbuck's. He lost his son. You can't do this, EVER. EVER. EVER.

So even when I'm running to my P O Box and I have all four children with me, and it will take LITERALLY 30 seconds to get my mail, I have to unbuckle and take all four children in with me. And I do it gladly, because I'm so thankful to have my four children.

You just don't do it. And the government is judging here, not triplet moms. IT'S AGAINST THE LAW.
Michele
Sarah, Gregory, Amanda
born 1/22/04 at 35w1d

Our surprise baby Austin born 06/15/2005

www.fourtimesthefun.blogspot.com

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morethemerrier
Wed Jul-30-08 01:26 AM
Member since Nov 05th 2007
2081 posts


#364982, "RE: Need to vent!"
In response to Reply # 16

Baloney. Its a misdameanor.

http://www.leg.state.nv.us/73rd/bills/SB/SB287_EN.pdf

At the beginning of this it mentions that existing law lays out punishment for abuse neglect and endangerment that IS a felony, but goes on to say: :

Legislative Counsel’s Digest:

This bill prohibits a parent, legal guardian or other person who is responsible
for a child who is 7 years of age or younger from knowingly and intentionally
leaving the child in a motor vehicle without the supervision of a person who is at
least 12 years of age IF the conditions present a significant risk to the health and
safety of the child;OR (2) the engine of the motor vehicle is running or the keys to
the vehicle are in the ignition.

A person who violates this provision is guilty of a
misdemeanor.


However, this bill allows a court to suspend the proceedings and
dismiss the proceedings if the person completes an educational program
satisfactory to the court. This bill further provides that the penalties of this
provision do not apply if the person may be prosecuted under another provision of
law. Thus, if the conduct of the parent, legal guardian or other person rises to the
level of abuse or neglect of the child, this provision would not apply.
MTM - mom to Michael(84),Stephan(85), Thomas, Matthew and Kathryn - born 12/27/99 at 32w 0 days

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LolasLadies
Wed Jul-30-08 01:56 AM
Member since Nov 05th 2007
939 posts


#364986, "RE: Need to vent!"
In response to Reply # 27

http://www.lasvegasnow.com/Global/story.asp?S=8648968

This just happened in Vegas. They are being charged with 8 counts of felony child endangerment for leaving their children in a van because of the hot temperatures, which in Vegas, seems to happen for 7/10 of the year. I guess it depends on the situation.
Lola's GGG 28-weekers born Jan.2005
Alison 2.3 Emma 2.2 Kristin 1.11
The world's least triplet-related triplet blog: http://sweetenedtaters.blogspot.com

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morethemerrier
Wed Jul-30-08 02:02 AM
Member since Nov 05th 2007
2081 posts


#364988, "RE: Need to vent!"
In response to Reply # 30

My guess its that it goes to the "level of abuse" which provides the loophole to prosecute dummies that leave their kids in such conditions that would result in a fatality.
MTM - mom to Michael(84),Stephan(85), Thomas, Matthew and Kathryn - born 12/27/99 at 32w 0 days

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lsmiller
Wed Jul-30-08 08:04 AM
Member since Jul 18th 2005
701 posts


#365009, "RE: Need to vent!"
In response to Reply # 31

I'm from Vegas as well. In this town it CAN go to the level of abuse. During the summer months - the temperatures go as high as 150 degrees inside a closed car in minutes.

A recent news story was about a woman whose 4 year old was in the car while she was getting her nails done. She was to be married that day. Her son was dead when she got back to the car.

You DO NOT leave your children in the car in Las Vegas. Not even for 30 seconds - you WILL be arrested if you are caught.
Laraine
Mom to one beautiful Angel - Alexandra Whitney (7/28/03 - 7/31/03)
and two wonderful boys
Brian James & Charles Vincent 7/28/03 34wks4days


http://www.brianandcharlie.com/blog

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sandsstone
Tue Jul-29-08 08:55 PM
Member since Nov 05th 2007
1061 posts


#364933, "RE: Need to vent!"
In response to Reply # 0

So what is the definition of unattended, just for clarification because I know I have run into some situations that I wonder how I would deal with it if I was alone. I know if I leave it running with the keys in it that is a no no...but what about

If I get out to pump gas...is that unattended?
How about if I hear a loud thump and I get out to look what it was and if all the pieces of my vehicle are still in tact?
If I am dumping the accumulated crud out of the vehicle into a curb side trash can?
What about returning the cart to the cart corral at the box store?
Does it mean I have to be within touching distance?


I don't mean to be argumentative...I am just wondering where to draw the line? (and where to tell DH to draw the line)

Susan
Parent to GGG born 31 weeks 4 days 4/26/07
http://www.sandsstone.com


http://www.thedivinemercy.org/message

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foreveramom
Tue Jul-29-08 09:22 PM
Member since Jan 30th 2006
1073 posts


#364945, "RE: Need to vent!"
In response to Reply # 8

Susan, I think the rule of thumb is the "comfortable distance" thing. I've been in a parking lot where there have been strangers hanging around to watch me put my trio from the triple-decker into the car. That comfortable distance was about 12 inches away from their carseats.

I still don't run across to put the cart in the corral if I'm not right next to it. Not with my kids in the car. I'm maybe a bit too paranoid, but I'm just sure I'll be the one who gets hit by the dumba$$ teenager who flies around the corner in a parking lot and nobody will notice my kids in the car as I lay in the street dying.

DH deals with criminals every day. One of his clients jumped in a car and tried to drive off with the kids in the car while a woman was just outside her car. He couldn't get away because he couldn't drive a stick. Seriously. I hear about that kind of thing WAY too much.
Mom of: Kristi(22), Kevin(19), Kelli(17), Angus(5) and GGB - Ruca, Nadia and Max (3) Born 10-14-04 at 34 weeks.
www.angusandthetriplets.com
also www.angusandthetriplets.blogspot.com

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PA triplets
Tue Jul-29-08 09:22 PM
Member since Nov 05th 2007
1380 posts


#364946, "RE: Need to vent!"
In response to Reply # 8

I have a question too. How do you get a cart at the grocery or department store if you don't leave them unattended for a few seconds? I usually drive around the whole parking lot trying to find a 3 kid cart. Most of the time I find one and park near it. However, once or twice I had to leave them in the car to get a cart. It was in cool weather so I took the keys with me and locked them in the car. I would never do that in warm weather or leave the keys in the car. Now that my kids are older they can walk with me to find a cart, but that wasn't the case earlier. How do you get carts?

Lori


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gracy3
Wed Jul-30-08 07:46 AM
Member since Jul 18th 2005
2003 posts


#365002, "RE: Need to vent!"
In response to Reply # 15
Wed Jul-30-08 07:51 AM by gracy3

Lori - Your idea of parking near the cart is a good one, but if that is not possible....If your kids are old enough to walk - they walk with you to get the cart - otherwise - I used my stroller and pulled a shopping cart behind me. I taught my kids to hold hands at a very early age.
Gracy
BGG (9/18/04 @ 31 weeks) and G (3/6/06 at 38 weeks)...
Save the babies!
www.marchforbabies.org/4littlesplinters

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Mom23in2003
Tue Jul-29-08 09:05 PM
Member since Jul 18th 2005
1151 posts


#364939, "RE: Need to vent!"
In response to Reply # 0

I know my DH has done this. I've told him not to, but he has.

The only time I can remember leaving my kids in the car when I've gotten out is to put library books in a return slot about 10 feet away from the car on the outside of the library. Literally 5 seconds round trip. I don't think I would ever go inside a store or building of any kind with my kids still in the car. Just too many bad things can happen.
Kristen

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HOWMANY
Tue Jul-29-08 09:17 PM
Member since Jul 18th 2005
1290 posts


#364944, "RE: Need to vent!"
In response to Reply # 0

Well I won't let you sit out on that dingy by yourself!

I have left my kids in the car with it running, without it running and windows down.

Mostly at the ATM machine with the car right there. But there was one time the spot was not open on the street right in front and I parked around the corner. It was "winter" in So. Cal so I was not worried about heat. But I did feel a bit crappy about it.

I also load my girls up in the car and I buckle them in and run back in the house to grab DS and shut his bedside vent off, sometimes I have to suction him.

Flame away! You do what you gotta do. But that being said there are lots of stops I won't do when I have my DS with me cause it takes longer to pull out and bulid/break down his wheelchair then the actual act.

Amy
Wife to Jason(pixelpusher)
Mom to Gwynne, Connor, Chloe 11/03/03
25wks 1day

www.caringbridge.org/visit/connorferris

http://lilypie.com>

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GRACY1
Tue Jul-29-08 09:37 PM
Member since Nov 05th 2007
73 posts


#364949, "RE: Need to vent!"
In response to Reply # 13

Obviously, some posters were more gracious than others, as for the poster who called about the children being left at the emergency room. Absolutely, I am not an idiot,i would have called to but come on.If you posted a reply that was sarcastic,rude,mean,or not helpful than you know what you wrote. I will not sit here and say i have never done it,i have gone to pay for gas, emptied my trash ect. Do i regret it,yes, I am with the poster who wants to know what is the definition of UNATTENDED?I would love to know what you all think. Thanks Gracy1

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MSTAR
Tue Jul-29-08 10:01 PM
Member since Jul 18th 2005
1789 posts


#364956, "RE: Need to vent!"
In response to Reply # 17

I think you should look at the law in your state. All states vary on this. Some are definitely more punitive than others. The original poster should check the laws in her state as well. Our law was changed and made more punitive after a rash of car-jackings and children left in the heat who died.

Our law was written so broadly that if the DA really wanted to, they could prosecute you for leaving your kids in your driveway. We had a situation where a father left his kids in the car in his driveway and one of them put the car in neutral and it rolled down the driveway, down the street, and down in embankment. They did not charge him, although it was in the news because they could have charged him. (I read the paper every day and have always been active in local politics.)

As far as parking lots and getting carts, I leave my cart in front of my car if I can't get it back reasonably. I have walked over 3 or 4 spots to get a cart and it makes me have a sick feeling in my stomach because I know that if something happened, I could be charged if the DA really wanted to and I'm so happy that they are older now and I can just walk in with them.

So really, know your laws in your state and use common sense.
Michele
Sarah, Gregory, Amanda
born 1/22/04 at 35w1d

Our surprise baby Austin born 06/15/2005

www.fourtimesthefun.blogspot.com

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tvmurphy
Tue Jul-29-08 09:55 PM
Member since Nov 05th 2007
192 posts


#364954, "RE: Need to vent!"
In response to Reply # 0

Please look at this site.

I hope that you will think twice about leaving your children unattended in a car, it is not just your child that could be harmed...

http://www.harrisonshope.org/


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GRACY1
Tue Jul-29-08 10:04 PM
Member since Nov 05th 2007
73 posts


#364957, "RE: Need to vent!"
In response to Reply # 18

This is a very informative website. I wish this had been an earlier reply to the original post.Sometimes life experience is more of an eye opener than unhelpful comments. Kudos...Gracy1

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fof
Wed Jul-30-08 01:40 AM
Member since Jun 23rd 2008
38 posts


#364983, "RE: Need to vent!"
In response to Reply # 21

Gracy
Glad somebody has had the courage to say what you have. This is the second time in a few days that I've seen nasty sarcastic comments on this site. It's beginning to remind me of school yard tactics ie many picking on one! Leaving your children alone in the car is not ideal or safe but nobody is perfect. We all make mistakes and do things sometimes that others don't agree with. I agree with Gracy that this does not give anyone the right to judge or insult another person. I think standing by the car when someone runs an errand would be a kind and helpful thing to do. Reporting a mother for trying to get ice cream? Come on?

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foreveramom
Wed Jul-30-08 06:02 AM
Member since Jan 30th 2006
1073 posts


#364996, "RE: Need to vent!"
In response to Reply # 28

If you think it's not serious?

http://www.wesh.com/news/16905684/detail.html

I re-read a lot of the comments and I'm trying to find the ones with insults in them. I can't. Just differences of opinion.
Mom of: Kristi(22), Kevin(19), Kelli(17), Angus(5) and GGB - Ruca, Nadia and Max (3) Born 10-14-04 at 34 weeks.
www.angusandthetriplets.com
also www.angusandthetriplets.blogspot.com

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albentrip
Tue Jul-29-08 09:58 PM
Member since Jul 18th 2005
275 posts


#364955, "RE: Need to vent!"
In response to Reply # 0

I'm not going to address the legal issue but there is a safety issue you should be aware of.

One of my triplets learned to unbuckle the carseat that I thought she was secured in at the age of two. I was standing right outside the car for literally 2 minutes talking to a friend after dropping my older son off at a baseball game. The next thing I knew, there was my two-year old walking into the parking lot looking for me. Thank goodness there were no cars coming and I saw her but you never know when they are going to master those seatbelts. It scared the daylights out of me and I was right there.

My escape artist obviously mastered the buckle early but the point is you don't know when they will.

I think I would have been annoyed by that stranger but in hindsight I would have thought she made a good point.

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Katrina_Jason
Tue Jul-29-08 10:13 PM
Member since Apr 29th 2008
111 posts


#364960, "RE: Need to vent!"
In response to Reply # 0

I am glad this was brought up. Until I read everyones replies and really thought about the "what ifs" I myself may have been tempted to do something similar in the future. Now I will know better...must say I brought this up to DH and he thinks it's a bit much to not be able to leave them in the car when you are within sight(except for heat/cold). I can see I need to explain the dangers to him further.
http://lilypie.com>

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lovemy5boys
Tue Jul-29-08 11:13 PM
Member since Nov 05th 2007
839 posts


#364973, "RE: Need to vent!"
In response to Reply # 0

I have never taken my kids out of the car to go to the atm, which is 6 feet away from where you park, basically almost my body length. I also have never taken my kids out of the car to get gas. BOth of these things are places where I am a 2 second sprint from my van. Is it right? no. But I'm not about to start taking them out of the car to walk 6 feet. That being said, I have never gone in a store, ice cream place, Starbucks, whatever, without taking them with me. It doesn't say in your post how far you were from them. We have an ice cream place here that is like 40 steps from your car. I still wouldn't leave then though. 6 ft and 40 ft are a big difference. I have to admit I am one of those people who would say something or wait by the car if I saw young children in there alone. I saw it about a yr ago and I was getting my phone out of my purse to call 911 as the mom came back. I agree though, getting them out does suck!! You just have to do it. Next time your getting them a treat make it something you can drive through like a shake or a cookie from McD's instead. just my 2 cents.
proud mom to
DS 6
DS 3
BBB 9/29/06






Visit me at:
http://amiehale.barefootparties.com/

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MargieInAZ
Wed Jul-30-08 01:21 AM
Member since Nov 05th 2007
241 posts


#364981, "RE: Need to vent!"
In response to Reply # 0

I read the OP, then I was reading all the comments, and I have to say, I was thinking I've never left mine in the car alone.
Then someone mentioned the driveway. I know that's kind of extreme, but I live a few houses away from a large park with a lot of sports fields in it and a lake. A lot of people park on my street and walk to the park, so I have a fair number of people walking in front of my house. Not a constant traffic jam, as it's a normal neighborhood, but most of the time if I look outside my front window, there's frequently someone I don't know walking down the street.
So, when I take the girls out by myself in the summer (I'm in AZ & it's 100+ degrees outside), I go out, start the car so the AC goes on, then go in and get each girl individually. I leave them in the play room, where it's safe, at the other end of the house while I'm loading up the others, so it takes me a minute or two to go back inside and get another baby. Right now, one is walking, the other two are not, so I take them to and from the car one at a time.
So, at any given time I have one or two babies in the van with the engine running and the doors open. I don't have a garage, it's a carport, so completely open to the street.
I realize that's an extreme example, and probably wouldn't get "arrested", but reading the responses to this thread, make me nervous to do this.
But what choice do I have? Does anyone have any other suggestions or options?
I know it's a slim chance that the van would be stolen with babies in it, but I know it does happen... Ugh.
Is this just a risk I have to live with?
Margie, 43, single



GGG, Chloe, Brianna & Taylor
Born 3/6/07 at 30w1d



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Tasha
Wed Jul-30-08 12:49 PM
Member since Jul 18th 2005
1760 posts


#365101, "RE: Need to vent!"
In response to Reply # 26

A remote car starter. Leave the kids out of the equation never leave her keys in the car to warm or cool it. A lady on the next block learned this lesson over the winter. They had been doing it for YEARS. Going out and starting the car to let it warm/cool (no kids involved) before work. Then one day someone comes and takes the car. The kick in the ass. They left the keys in the car so not covered. Don't know if it is the same with all policies but was with theirs. I have been meaning to ask my agent. The other kick the officer said they could be charged for leaving a running car. I had never heard it before. Probably some ordinance because the ease of theft and number of calls it generates. They didn't charge them but they were worried about it for a bit.

DH had a remote starter put on my van before the babies were born so I could warm/cool the van from inside the house and the car can't be taken(engine cuts if you touch a pedal). It is also great in parking lots to have the car heating/cooling while loading the kids. I would never put the keys in the ignition while I was outside the vehicle loading kids. I had a situation where a "gentleman" was wondering between my van and the next car like 3 times. I kept watching him and he was looking into my van. I think to see if the keys were there since it was running. If they were and he had decided to jump in and take off he would have had 1 or 2 of my children (not get buckled as I did everything in stages) as I was unbuckling another from the stroller. My one knee in the van wouldn't have stood up to the van taking off.
Tasha
Julia, Megan and Alex 7/00
Abby 12/02

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morethemerrier
Wed Jul-30-08 01:54 AM
Member since Nov 05th 2007
2081 posts


#364985, "Wow. Most of you must live in the 14 states"
In response to Reply # 0
Wed Jul-30-08 02:01 AM by morethemerrier

Thats right.... FOURTEEN states have laws about leaving them unattended in cars. And virtually every single one of them has EXCEPTIONS.

California (a) A parent, legal guardian, or other person responsible for a child who is 6 years of age or younger may not leave that child inside a motor vehicle without being subject to the supervision of a person who is 12 years of age or older, under either of the following circumstances:

(1) Where there are conditions that present a significant risk to the child's health or safety.

(2) When the vehicle’s engine is running or the vehicle's keys are in the ignition, or both.

(b) A violation of subdivision (a) is an infraction punishable by a fine of one hundred dollars ($100),

Connecticut - (a) Any parent, guardian or person having custody or control, or providing supervision, of any child under the age of twelve years knowingly leaves such child unsupervised in a place for a period of time that presents a vehicle for a period of time that presents a substantial risk to the child's health or safety, shall be guilty of a Class A misdemeanor.
(b) Any parent, guardian or person having custody or control, or providing supervision, of any child under the age of twelve years knowingly leaves such child unsupervised in place of public accommodation, which holds a permit issued under chapter 545 of the general statutes for the sale of alcoholic liquor for consumption on the premises, for a period of time that presents a substantial risk to the child's health or safety, shall be guilty of a Class D felony.
(c) Any parent, guardian or person having custody or control, or providing supervision, of any child under the age of twelve years knowingly leaves such child unsupervised in place of public accommodation or motor vehicle between the hours of eight o'clock p.m. and six o'clock a.m. for a period of time that presents a substantial risk to the child's health or safety, shall be guilty of a Class C felony.


Florida - (1) No parent, legal guardian, or other person responsible for a child younger than 6 years of age shall leave such child unattended or unsupervised in a motor vehicle for a period in excess of 15 minutes; however, no such person shall leave a child unattended for any period of time if the motor vehicle is running or the health of the child is in danger.
(2) Any person who violates the provisions of subsection (1) is guilty of a noncriminal traffic infraction, punishable by a fine of:
(a) Not more than $100; or
(b) Not less than $50 and not more than $500 if the motor vehicle was running or the health of the child was in danger at the time of violation.


Hawaii Way too long and too convoluted to interpret:

http://www.capitol.hawaii.gov/sessioncurrent/bills/HB356_.htm



Illinois (a) It is unlawful for any person to willfully cause or permit the life or health of a child under the age of 18 to be endangered or to willfully cause or permit a child to be placed in circumstances that endanger the child's life or health.
(a-5) A person commits the offense of endangering the life or health of a child if he or she leaves a child unattended in a motor vehicle. For purposes of this subsection:

(1) There is a rebuttable presumption that a person committed the offense if he or she left a child unattended in a motor vehicle for more than 10 minutes .

(2) "Unattended" means either: (i) not accompanied by a person 14 years of age or older; or (ii) if accompanied by a person 14 years of age or older, out of sight of that person.
(b) A violation of this Section is a Class A misdemeanor. A second or subsequent violation of this Section is a Class 3 felony.

Lousiana B.(1) The term "unattended" as used in this Section means a
16 child who has been left in a motor vehicle when the driver or operator of the vehicle is more than ten feet from the vehicle and unable to continuously observe the child.

(2) The term "unsupervised" as used in this Section means an
unattended child when a person ten years of age or older is not
physically present in the motor vehicle.

C.(1) A law enforcement officer who observes a child left
unattended and unsupervised, for a period in excess of ten minutes, in violation of the provisions of this Section shall use whatever means arereasonably necessary to protect the child and remove the child from the motor vehicle.

(2) If the child is removed from the immediate area by a law
enforcement officer pursuant to the provisions of this Section, the law enforcement officer shall place notification on the motor vehicle. The law enforcement officer shall hold the child until the parent or guardian returns. The parent or guardian shall be issued a summons which carries a fine that shall not exceed twenty-five dollars.

Maryland Unattended Children.
Confinement in dwelling, building, enclosure, or motor vehicle.
(a) In general-A person who is charged with the care of a child under the age of 8 years may not allow the child to be locked or confined in a dwelling, building, enclosure, or motor vehicle while the person charged is absent and the dwelling, building, enclosure, or motor vehicle is out of sight of the personcharged unless the person charges provides a reliable person at least 13 years old to remain with the child to protect the child.
(b) Penalties for Violation- A person who violates this section is guilty of a misdemeanor and on conviction is subject to a fine not exceeding $500 or imprisonment not exceeding 30 days, or both.



Nebraska “Unattended in a motor vehicle”, as used in Section (1)(a), means either:

(i) not having a person in the motor vehicle who is eleven years of age or older accompanying the child, or

(ii) if accompanied by a person eleven years of age or older, out of sight of that person.

(4) “Minor child” means a person under the age of eighteen.

(5) Evidence that a person left a child six years of age or younger unattended in a motor vehicle for more than ten minutes shall be prima facie evidence of negligence as used herein.


Nevada This bill prohibits a parent, legal guardian or other person who is responsible for a child who is 7 years of age or younger from knowingly and intentionally leaving the child in a motor vehicle without the supervision of a person who is at least 12 years of age if: (1) the conditions present a significant risk to the health and
safety of the child; or (2) the engine of the motor vehicle is running or the keys to the vehicle are in the ignition. A person who violates this provision is guilty of a
misdemeanor. However, this bill allows a court to suspend the proceedings and dismiss the proceedings if the person completes an educational program satisfactory to the court. This bill further provides that the penalties of this provision do not apply if the person may be prosecuted under another provision of law. Thus, if the conduct of the parent, legal guardian or other person rises to the level of abuse or neglect of the child, this provision would not apply

Pennsylvania (a) General rule-A person driving or in charge of a motor vehicle may not permit a child under six years of age to remain unattended in the vehicle when the motor vehicle is out of the person's sight and under circumstances which endanger the health, safety, or welfare of the child.
(a.1) Applicability-This section shall apply to the highways and trafficways of this Commonwelath and, for the purpose of this section only, the tem "trafficways" shall include but not be limited to, parking lots.
(b) Penalty- A person who violates this section commits a summary offense.

Oklahoma - Cannot leave a child 6 or under (or vulnerable adult) if the conditions pose a risk, unless with a person who is mentally competant and is of the age of 12. Tennessee - all situations... unlawful to leave a child under 10 without supervision of someone 14 or older

Washington State... only unlawful to leave a child under the age of 16 in a vehicle if the motor is running .

and Texas, short and sweet...

Younger than 7 must not be left for more than 5 minutes without someone over the age of 14


So none of you live in the other 36 states I guess.
MTM - mom to Michael(84),Stephan(85), Thomas, Matthew and Kathryn - born 12/27/99 at 32w 0 days

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MSTAR
Wed Jul-30-08 05:25 AM
Member since Jul 18th 2005
1789 posts


#364994, "RE: Wow. Most of you must live in the 14 states"
In response to Reply # 29

Unfortunately, I see it as 14 states having no choice but to enact laws to ensure the safety of minors because parents are so irresponsible as to leave them unattended in a vehicle, with the keys in the ignition, while watching a movie, just to get ice cream.

If people used common sense, then laws like this wouldn't even be on the books.

How easily could someone have jumped behind the wheel and taken off with those four little children while the mother was carrying 5 ice cream cones back to the car?

I guarantee you that if that happened, regardless of what state she was in, then she would have been charged with something and then her state would be enacting laws to protect young children from being left unattended in a vehicle.

It looks like you are in advocate for leaving small children unattended to me. Did you do this youself all the time when your kids were small? Is that it?
Michele
Sarah, Gregory, Amanda
born 1/22/04 at 35w1d

Our surprise baby Austin born 06/15/2005

www.fourtimesthefun.blogspot.com

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sandsstone
Wed Jul-30-08 08:33 AM
Member since Nov 05th 2007
1061 posts


#365019, "RE: Wow. Most of you must live in the 14 states"
In response to Reply # 29

Hmmmm...In Maryland you can't go to the bathroom, in your own home, unless you take the child with you. You have to watch them nap. You have to watch them sleep at night.

Wow...parents must not sleep much in Maryland.

Susan
Parent to GGG born 31 weeks 4 days 4/26/07
http://www.sandsstone.com


http://www.thedivinemercy.org/message

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foreveramom
Wed Jul-30-08 08:57 AM
Member since Jan 30th 2006
1073 posts


#365027, "RE: Wow. Most of you must live in the 14 states"
In response to Reply # 29


>Florida - (1) No parent, legal guardian, or other person
>responsible for a child younger than 6 years of age shall
>leave such child unattended or unsupervised in a motor vehicle
>for a period in excess of 15 minutes

Darn it. I wish I would have known this! I can think of at least 10 things to do with a very precious 15 minutes while I leave my kids safely strapped in their carseats in our front yard (on a cool evening, of course) -- take a bath, grab a quickie, finish the last chapter of a good book, scrapbook, etc.

Just joking, but what a crazy law that one is.
Mom of: Kristi(22), Kevin(19), Kelli(17), Angus(5) and GGB - Ruca, Nadia and Max (3) Born 10-14-04 at 34 weeks.
www.angusandthetriplets.com
also www.angusandthetriplets.blogspot.com

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foreveramom
Wed Jul-30-08 06:06 AM
Member since Jan 30th 2006
1073 posts


#364997, "RE: Need to vent!"
In response to Reply # 0

Let's just leave all "breaking laws" out of this for a moment. If just having to pay a fine is all you end up with, you're lucky.

Does this look familiar?

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=96f_1206456062 This woman left her baby in her SUV while she walked up to a fast-food pick-up window.
Mom of: Kristi(22), Kevin(19), Kelli(17), Angus(5) and GGB - Ruca, Nadia and Max (3) Born 10-14-04 at 34 weeks.
www.angusandthetriplets.com
also www.angusandthetriplets.blogspot.com

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TiffaniRay
Wed Jul-30-08 07:18 AM
Member since Jul 18th 2005
3987 posts


#364999, "RE: Need to vent!"
In response to Reply # 34
Wed Jul-30-08 07:19 AM by TiffaniRay

I agree with you Lesa. Forget about the laws for a moment. Forget about the fines. Use common sense.

I didn't see any rude offensive comments on this thread so I am leaving it as is. I do see a lot of opinions and that is exactly what the OP asked for.

One more thing, just because your state does not have any "laws" in reference to unattended children in vehicles, doesn't mean they can't get you for something else, i.e., child neglect, child endangerment. There are also federal laws that can be used, I know, I have charged a few people with them.

ETA: Great website...

http://www.nhtsa.dot.gov/people/injury/enforce/ChildrenAndCars/pages/contents.htm
Tiffani & Ray(NJ)



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LolasLadies
Wed Jul-30-08 08:54 AM
Member since Nov 05th 2007
939 posts


#365025, "RE: Need to vent!"
In response to Reply # 35

I also saw nothing offensive about the remarks, and I am a guilty party!

My "D'oh" moment: At the time, I (incorrectly) justified it as: I was in a rural gardening store parking lot with few customers, it was hot outside, and they were asleep in the air conditioning. The employee asked me if I was sure they'd be okay in the truck, and I started to wonder if they WERE going to be okay. I ended up excusing myself and telling the employee I would come back later without the kids.

I completely agree that the fines are there because they remind us that we shouldn't do it when we can't make the correct - and sometimes difficult - decision ourselves. There are obviously some situations that are more dangerous than others, but why even take the risk? If something had happened to the kids while I was out shopping for a stupid hibiscus plant (or ice cream) I would never have forgiven myself.
Lola's GGG 28-weekers born Jan.2005
Alison 2.3 Emma 2.2 Kristin 1.11
The world's least triplet-related triplet blog: http://sweetenedtaters.blogspot.com

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casanndra
Wed Jul-30-08 07:51 AM
Member since Jul 18th 2005
176 posts


#365003, "RE: Need to vent!"
In response to Reply # 0

I remember hearing a few years ago in my state about a man who left his son in the van and walked to the ATM 6-10 feet away. Someone jumped in and took his car with the son inside. The boy was missing for 5 hours before they found the car parked on a side low traffic street. The baby was still inside.

Luckily it was spring and not too hot or cold.
Kelli

Morgan (10) & natural (by natural I mean concieved on top of a picnic table at a campground) BBG triplets Eric, Josh, and Hannah born @ 33w1d





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joan1256
Wed Jul-30-08 08:12 AM
Member since Nov 05th 2007
224 posts


#365011, "RE: Need to vent!"
In response to Reply # 0
Wed Jul-30-08 08:25 AM by joan1256

I think everyone has a different 'comfort zone' when it comes to the safety of their children. I have a friend who told me she hovers over her child at the grocery store so no one will steal her. I don't do that. I'm comfortable walking a few feet away from my three in the grocery store to look at something in the aisles. They are always in my sight though.

I think we are a little too paranoid when it comes to this stuff. Yes, horrible things happen to children left in cars. But horrible things happens to children playing in the safest homes too. You cannot watch all three of your children every second of the day. And we all know it takes only seconds for a tragedy to happen. You can safeguard your child all you want, but there will always be a way for them to get hurt or worse. You can only do the best you can.

As far as the car thing goes, I am comfortable leaving my trio in buckled in their car seats, with the windows down slightly on a hot day, for a minute or so while they are in my line of sight. I NEVER leave the car running, I put the emergency brake on (which I know they cannot undo because it's really stiff) and I take the keys with me. I'm more worried about them getting out of their car seats, putting the car into neutral and letting it roll, but since the emergency brake is on, I know they can't and won't. I'm less worried that someone will brake into my locked 2005 Toyota Sienna van (with a large scratch down the side of it, BTW), hotwire it to start it and drive off with three screaming kids in the back seats all in the two minutes I'm not in the car. Besides, I just know they would drive them right back to me
Joan
mom to Caroline, Erin and Robbie
born 9/26/05 @ 35 weeks

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MelissaChicago
Wed Jul-30-08 08:12 AM
Member since Nov 05th 2007
200 posts


#365012, "RE: Need to vent!"
In response to Reply # 0

Last Christmas (or the one before, can't remember), a woman took her 3 older kids to drop money in a Salvation Army collection can and left her newborn sleeping in the car. They were within maybe 10-15 feet of the car at all times (can't remember exactly) and there were back within less than a minute. The police got involved and I don't remember the outcome, but I just remember feeling sorry for this poor woman. She was showing her other three children what philanthropy is all about, and got chastized and roasted by the public because of it. This was so obviously NOT a dangerous situation for the sleeping baby in the car. I do agree kids should never be left alone in cars with the keys, the doors should be LOCKED, the temp shouldn't be extreme either way, and it should be for the briefest of moments with the car in sight.

Anyway, what has the world come to when a mom can't teach her kids to donate to charity?

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fof
Wed Jul-30-08 08:33 AM
Member since Jun 23rd 2008
38 posts


#365020, "RE: Need to vent!"
In response to Reply # 40

o thank god! I was starting to think I was the only person with these opinions. I don't live in the US and I do live in a safe small community where crime is almost nil so I probably shouldn't even offer an opinion but..... I think what the two pp said are fair and reasonable. I think no matter how hard you try you can't protect your children from everyhing and I think in the long run it might end up frightening children. I'd hate to live somewhere where strapping your child into the car and running to get another was unsafe. I'm genuinely sorry for those of you who have to live with that fear.

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6BlueEyes
Wed Jul-30-08 09:30 AM
Member since Jul 18th 2005
373 posts


#365039, "RE: Need to vent!"
In response to Reply # 40

I remember that. A judge ended up throwing it out with "apologies" to that woman. It would have been nice if the policeman used some common sense. That child was not in danger and it just ended up costing the IL taxpayers a lot of money and that woman a huge inconvenience and I'm sure a lot of $.
Kelly
Ben, Jack & Drew 05/28/02
Charlie 07/06/06
Aunt to: Liam, Aidan & Connor 03/05/08
www.outnumberedmommy.blogspot.com

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lsmiller
Wed Jul-30-08 08:33 AM
Member since Jul 18th 2005
701 posts


#365021, "RE: Need to vent!"
In response to Reply # 0

Here is a very intersting website I came across:

http://www.kidsandcars.org/
Laraine
Mom to one beautiful Angel - Alexandra Whitney (7/28/03 - 7/31/03)
and two wonderful boys
Brian James & Charles Vincent 7/28/03 34wks4days


http://www.brianandcharlie.com/blog

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VonWasden
Wed Jul-30-08 09:09 AM
Member since Nov 05th 2007
2863 posts


#365032, "RE: Need to vent!"
In response to Reply # 0

I do this even today. Sometimes you just can't haul them all in. It's usally at the convenience store, with the car running, emergency brake on and the door locked. Mine are 6 and 4. Honestly, people just don't have to comment about everything all the time. It sounds like she was trying to be nice about it, thankfully she didn't report you. Try not to worry about it.
Kim
Nate, Nick & Noel(36w4d)and Nia.

http://www.tickercentral.com>


http://www.tickercentral.com>

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fulloffaith
Wed Jul-30-08 10:32 AM
Member since Nov 05th 2007
286 posts


#365056, "RE: Need to vent!"
In response to Reply # 0

Lisa,

The only time I have left my kids in the car was when I saw a garage sale and I only had 2 of them, one was home with Daddy. I parked by the house because I saw there were cribs for sale. It was later in the day and it wasnt crowded or anything so I jumped out and talked to the lady but the whole time I was looking back at my car which I had left running so they could have A/C. It made me so nervous so I say if it makes you feel bad, then you shouldn't be doing it. My DH and I talked about it and we agreed I would never do that again. Just to many what ifs like PP have said. Before we have kids we don't think about stuff like that but now that we do, we have to always consider the worst that can happen and do everything we can to make sure the worst doesnt happen to our kids. I am sure you feel bad now and will learn from it. That is what all of us should do. Thanks for the post, I think you made everyone question what they would do.
http://web.mac.com/klezon/Site/Welcome.html

Allison mommy to:
Annalise Marie 5.6, Isaac Mason 4.11 and Elijah Jaxon 5.9
Born 12/31/07, 34w3d



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StefMac2
Wed Jul-30-08 10:59 AM
Member since Nov 05th 2007
612 posts


#365066, "RE: Need to vent!"
In response to Reply # 48

This is an interesting discussion to me because I never go out alone and it is quite frustrating. I also live in NYC so I may be a little more fearful. For me to leave alone, I would have to load a baby into a car, leave them unattended, get the other, leave two unattended and get the third. Yes I wish I had a garage! I don't do it. I live in a gated community but I am too afraid. I ask a neighbor to watch the car or a family member. As far as going out, I have walked for a cart but only in the parking lot where I can see the cars and I am hoping by the time they are two, they can walk well enough.
If I go to my sister who lives in the suburbs, people leave their kids to nap in cars while they watch little league games and we can't believe it. I guess there are many people that feel that they live in a safe area so nothing can happen but that will never be me! There are so many times, I feel like telling people that predators do drive. They may not live in this neighborhood but they can live in one 5 minutes away. Crazy people can go into different neighborhoods.
Stefanie

Mom to Luke, Adriana, & Noah
33 weeks 6 days
3/3/07

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gracy3
Wed Jul-30-08 12:18 PM
Member since Jul 18th 2005
2003 posts


#365095, "RE: Need to vent!"
In response to Reply # 0

While I in bring groceries into the house, I will often leave my kids asleep in my car in my driveway while I unload my groceries into the garage(less than 10 feet from the car) - I shut the ignition and open the windows (in the summer). If they are sound asleep, I will even empty the bags onto my pantry shelves/refigerator (which are in the garage). What is safer - leaving them asleep in the car or having them awake and alone in the house while I unload the car - or worse having them run aound the drveway while I unload the car? I am often alone when I go food shopping so I have have to choose the lesser of the evils.

Do I let my kids go out in my fenced in and gate locked yard - yes -with some precaution - if I am in the basement (which is right off the yard) and the door is left open - the kids are always in my sight/earshot. Do I let them go out in the yard while I am upstairs cooking - heck no! We have a family on our block - there are 3 kids ranging from age 2-10. These kids are outside running in the streets constantly - with the 10 yr as adult supervision. I am so petrified that I am going to run one over as they often hide behind or under cars on the block or dark out from behind cars. It is a miracle that one of them has not been seriously hurt. My kids have played "out front" once this summer - that was with DH, my aunt, DB and myself out there- other than that - my kids play in the yard.

Have I returned my cart (3-4 spaces away) after I buckle my kids into the car? Of course- who hasn't? Have I gone to get a cart with them in the car - not usually, but that is only becase they walk well in a parking lot - if it were safer for me to get a cart and load them at my car - I would do it that way. Have I used an Outdoor ATM that I can practically drive right up to - in a pinch, yes I have- I always make sure the car is off, I have the keys and the car is locked.

If I have to go to the pharmacy either the kids go inside with me or if they are sick, my pharmacist comes out to get my scripts and then brings them back out when they are ready so I can stay in the car with the kids.

When I am in a store, my kids are in my cart or holding on to it as we walk togather - it is also a pet peeve of mine when kids run around a store unattended.

All that being said, I can't tell you how many times I'd kill for a latte, but won't get it because I will not leave the kids in the car to go into a Starbucks - that is beyond the boundary- if I am that desperate, I will take them inside with me or drive a few extra blocks out of the way to a drive-through Dunkin Donuts. I will not "run in" to pick up my dry cleaning - the key point here is "run in" - if I have to enter a building even if the store is empty or there is no line - that is beyond the boundary.

Every situation is different - as parents we do what we believe is good for our kids and try to do so with some level of common sense. I do believe the mom who started this original post did not believe she was putting her kids in harms way - else she would not have done it - perhaps she as well as many of us will think twice next time we consider the boundaries after hearing many different takes on the situation.

Just my .02

Gracy
BGG (9/18/04 @ 31 weeks) and G (3/6/06 at 38 weeks)...
Save the babies!
www.marchforbabies.org/4littlesplinters

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